I was recently perusing the comment stream of a friend of mine who has embarked on a journey away from organized Christianity while still claiming to embrace Christ. I have followed her musings and posts with interest, as there are many things that she has rallied against that also strike a chord with me and my own journey. Recently she posted a comment that while sounding smart seemed to overly simplistic. The post was as follows:
Jan Darlene Hastings posted this quote below: "Morality is doing what is right no matter what you are told. Religion is doing what you are told no matter what is right. "
I read the comment stream with interest and found that the majority of the posters, including my friend who posted it, felt that it was brilliant and on the mark. I felt the need to counter with the following:
Do we have a sin nature? Do we need a Savior? If we are so capable of "Choosing the Right/Moral" why do so many "honorable" people so often get exposed for their secret moral flaws? Oh and those that say "no" to the above questions: are tra...its such as Hubris, Denial of flaws, superiority complex, etc. moral?
Relative truth is not truth, just as relative morality is not truly moral, for in some tribes it's moral to eat your captives, and yet to honor that morality would be to sanction murder.
Lastly, If we just "know" the difference between right and wrong, who gave us this knowledge? In this sense I could reconstruct the statement to be "religion is doing what is morally right, no matter what you are told", but that too would fall short, as religion is mans attempt to understand God. Yet in the attempt we gain wisdom and perspective and move closer to an absolute that teaches us to be moral. Without it we are blind men struggling in the dark to describe the elephant before us.
(apologetics borrowed from C.S. Lewis-Mere Christianity) Peace
Today, someone "liked" my response and then proceeded to post the following three comments. I felt that they were so "Brilliant" and "On the Mark", that I felt the need to post them here on my blog for others to consider. I contacted the poster and was informed that the "School" posts were from a forwarded email. The other thoughts are her own. Thank you Angela Adams for these "pearls". Here they are:
Subject: God VS Science
'Let me explain the problem science has with religion. 'The atheist professor of philosophy pause...s before his class and then asks one of his new students to stand.
'You're a Christian, aren't you, son?'
'Yes sir, 'the student says.
'So you believe in God?'
'Absolutely.'
Is God good?'
'Sure! God's good.'
'Is God all-powerful? Can God do anything?'
'Yes'
'Are you good or evil?'
'The Bible says I'm evil.'
The professor grins knowingly. 'Aha! The Bible!’ He considers for a moment. 'Here's one for you. Let's say there's a sick person over here and you can cure him. You can do it. Would you help him? Would you try?'
'Yes sir, I would.'
'So you're good...!'
'I wouldn't say that.'
'But why not say that? You'd help a sick and maimed person if you could. Most of us would if we could. But God doesn't.'
The student does not answer, so the professor continues. 'He doesn't, does he? My brother was a Christian who died of cancer, even though he prayed to Jesus to heal him. How is this Jesus good? Can you answer that one?'
The student remains silent. 'No, you can't, can you?' the professor says. He takes a sip of water from a glass on his desk to give the student time to relax. 'Let's start again, young fella. Is God good?'
'Er..yes,' the student says.
'Is Satan good?'
The student doesn't hesitate on this one. 'No.'
'Then where does Satan come from?'
The student falters. 'From God'
'That's right. God made Satan, didn't he? Tell me, son. Is there evil in this world?'
'Yes, sir..'
'Evil's everywhere, isn't it? And God did make everything, correct?'
'Yes'
'So who created evil?' The professor continued, 'If God created everything, then God created evil, since evil exists, and according to the principle that our works define who we are, then God is evil.'
Again, the student has no answer. 'Is there sickness? Immorality? Hatred? Ugliness? All these terrible things, do they exist in this world?'
The student squirms on his feet. 'Yes.'
'So who created them?'
The student does not answer again, so the professor repeats his question. 'Who created them?' There is still no answer. Suddenly the lecturer breaks away to pace in front of the classroom. The class is mesmerized. 'Tell me,' he continues onto another student. 'Do you believe in Jesus Christ, son?'
The student's voice betrays him and cracks. 'Yes, professor, I do.'
The old man stops pacing. 'Science says you have five senses you use to identify and observe the world around you. Have you ever seen Jesus?'
'No sir. I've never seen Him.'
'Then tell us if you've ever heard your Jesus?'
'No, sir, I have not..'
'Have you ever felt your Jesus, tasted your Jesus or smelt your Jesus? Have you ever had any sensory perception of Jesus Christ, or God for that matter?'
'No, sir, I'm afraid I haven't.'
'Yet you still believe in him?'
'Yes'
'According to the rules of empirical, testable, demonstrable protocol, science says your God doesn't exist... What do you say to that, son?'
'Nothing,' the student replies.. 'I only have my faith.'
'Yes, faith,' the professor repeats. 'And that is the problem science has with God. There is no evidence, only faith.'
The student stands quietly for a moment, before asking a question of His own. 'Professor, is there such thing as heat?'
'Yes. ’
'And is there such a thing as cold?'
'Yes, son, there's cold too.'
'No sir, there isn't.'
The professor turns to face the student, obviously interested. The room suddenly becomes very quiet. The student begins to explain. 'You can have lots of heat, even more heat, super-heat, mega-heat, unlimited heat, white heat, a little heat or no heat, but we don't have anything called 'cold'. We can hit down to 458 degrees below zero, which is no heat, but we can't go any further after that. There is no such thing as cold; otherwise we would be able to go colder than the lowest -458 degrees. Every body or object is susceptible to study when it has or transmits energy, and heat is what makes a body or matter have or transmit energy. Absolute zero (-458 F) is the total absence of heat. You see, sir, cold is only a word we use to describe the absence of heat. We cannot measure cold. Heat we can measure in thermal units because heat is energy. Cold is not the opposite of heat, sir, just the absence of it.'
Silence across the room. A pen drops somewhere in the classroom, sounding like a hammer.
'What about darkness, professor. Is there such a thing as darkness?'
'Yes,' the professor replies without hesitation.. 'What is night if it isn't darkness?'
'You're wrong again, sir. Darkness is not something; it is the absence of something. You can have low light, normal light, bright light, flashing light, but if you have no light constantly you have nothing and it's called darkness, isn't it? That's the meaning we use to define the word. In reality, darkness isn't. If it were, you would be able to make darkness darker, wouldn't you?'
The professor begins to smile at the student in front of him. This will be a good semester. 'So what point are you making, young man?'
'Yes, professor. My point is, your philosophical premise is flawed to start with, and so your conclusion must also be flawed.'
The professor's face cannot hide his surprise this time. 'Flawed? Can you explain how?'
'You are working on the premise of duality,' the student explains... 'You argue that there is life and then there's death; a good God and a bad God. You are viewing the concept of God as something finite, something we can measure. Sir, science can't even explain a thought.' 'It uses electricity and magnetism, but has never seen, much less fully understood either one. To view death as the opposite of life is to be ignorant of the fact that death cannot exist as a substantive thing. Death is not the opposite of life, just the absence of it.' '
Now tell me, professor.. Do you teach your students that they evolved from a monkey?'
'If you are referring to the natural evolutionary process, young man, yes, of course I do.'
'Have you ever observed evolution with your own eyes, sir?'
Th...e professor begins to shake his head, still smiling, as he realizes where the argument is going. A very good semester, indeed.
'Since no one has ever observed the process of evolution at work and cannot even prove that this process is an on-going endeavor, are you not teaching your opinion, sir? Are you now not a scientist, but a preacher?'
The class is in uproar.
The student remains silent until the commotion has subsided.
'To continue the point you were making earlier to the other student, let me give you an example of what I mean..' The student looks around the room. 'Is there anyone in the class who has ever seen the professor's brain?'
The class breaks out into laughter.
'Is there anyone here who has ever heard the professor's brain, felt the professor's brain, touched or smelt the professor's brain? No one appears to have done so. So, according to the established rules of empirical, stable, demonstrable protocol, science says that you have no brain, with all due respect, sir.' 'So if science says you have no brain, how can we trust your lectures, sir?'
Now the room is silent. The professor just stares at the student, his face unreadable.
Finally, after what seems an eternity, the old man answers. 'I Guess you'll have to take them on faith.'
'Now, you accept that there is faith, and, in fact, faith exists with life,' the student continues. 'Now, sir, is there such a thing as evil?'
Now uncertain, the professor responds, 'Of course, there is. We see it Everyday. It is in the daily example of man's inhumanity to man. It is in The multitude of crime and violence everywhere in the world. These manifestations are nothing else but evil.'
To this the student replied, 'Evil does not exist sir, or at least it does not exist unto itself. Evil is simply the absence of God. It is just like darkness and cold, a word that man has created to describe the absence of God. God did not create evil. Evil is the result of what happens when man does not have God's love present in his heart. It's like the cold that comes when there is no heat or the darkness that comes when there is no light.'
The professor sat down. ..
(Forwarded email posted on Facebook.Author unknown)
What a great dialogue. I love good apologetics. And finally the post from Angela Adams that offers her own insights. Here it is:
Thought for the day: "Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good. "
It's scripture, and I learned it because my church taught me that it was good to "hide the word in my heart", as scripture teaches. I continue to be a Chris...tian, and could validly convert to Catholicism not so much because of the charisma of its own members, but because of the rich, profound way that believers over the centuries have strived (Striven?!?!?!) to incorporate scriptural principals into religious practices. I believe that the religious practices may be cultural in some instances, yes, but remain useful when they lead others to the truth of the Word of God. To reject outright the good which that leads others to is to deny others of the same opportunity of access to God's goodness, which, being infinite, no human will fully comprehend until the end of time.
Thank you Angela for your posts. May God continue to show you Love while giving you Wisdom. I guess that's my prayer for me and all of you as well.
Peace, Jon
